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Welcome ye Grand Subscribers and Seekers of Truth and Awareness.
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~ April - Page 1 ~
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Subject: RE: world hunger
From: "Ragland, Thomas" <TRagland@UMCOM.ORG>
Date: Mon, 1 Apr 2002 07:21:16 -0600
Karl Marx concluded this and it was experimented with on a global scale as Communism. But once again greed and desire reared its ugly head and the few in control kept the majority as peasants in poverty. Every revolution frees someone from some oppression, only to then create a new oppression in the vacuum. The Shah is gone, now Khomeni is the problem. The Roman Empire is gone, now the Church is the problem. Whenever we have pushed aside the "conditioned perception of wealth", executed the greedy and distributed their wealth, the cycle starts all over again. The problem is not the stuff, it is the clinging to the stuff. American economy is based on the trickle down delusion that everyone will end up with more if everyone just spends more--feeds the beast. It is conditioned and completely delusional, but it keeps the US rolling as a wealthy nation with trillions of dollars in debt. And now money is plastic cards. You don't have to already have the money to buy that new car, that big tv, that fast computer--just charge it. More mind games.
Until people wake up to the dhamma that defining yourself as being, as possessing, or as being possessed by all of this collected stuff, nothing will ever change. If you remain detached, money can be a useful tool. If you remain greedy, money can be your coffin. It is like alcoholism. The alcoholic cannot take one sip without being controlled by the desire. A non-alcoholic can drink large quantities and then let it go because it doesn't control the will. Initiates into the dhamma are told to be completely ascetic, detached from all that conditioning that is deluding their wills. Adapts in the dhamma can reinvolve themselves with what they once had to detach from in the tantric experience of being in control. Money is a weird subject, for how do you control and channel something that only exists in the minds of people?
Subject: Reality and the Grand Trickster
From: o.dodge@att.net
Date: Mon, 01 Apr 2002 18:17:39 +0000
I went to movies over the weekend. And before the movie - before they "fired up" the projector - I had a thought. It was about the movie screen and projector - and how similar they are to our everyday experience of reality.
Sitting there - quietly looking at that giant white screen - it was easy to understand what would soon happen. In a few minutes - they would turn on the projector and the movie would start. And magically, that giant white screen would fade away - and I would completely "forget" about the projector - the would-be true "source" of the picture - and I would develop this false sensation that some great story was actually taking place right in front of me - just as though I was watching it thru a window!
And it dawned on me that's pretty much what happens outside the theater with "reality". The face of reality acts pretty much just like that giant white movie screen or a mirror. When we look at reality - all we really see is an illusion - a REFLECTION of whatever is projected upon it.
Stand in front of an everyday mirror in a new hat. What will we see? What will we say to ourself? Something like..."There I am in my new hat!"
Because we understand what's going on - we understand that what we are seeing is merely a reflection of ourself in a new hat. We understand the "cause and effect". We understand that we are the "cause" of the image - and the reflection in the mirror is the "effect".
But now look at "reality". What happens is fairly similar. What if we face reality with let's say "hate" in our heart? What might we see? What do you suppose will be reflected back? What might we say to ourself? Probably something like..."I see hate! Reality is full of hate!"
Why? Because we don't understand what's really going on! We don't understand the "cause and effect". We don't recognize the "true source" of what is being reflected.
EJ's "Grand Trickster" has indeed pulled a great cosmic prank on us!...he has somehow convinced us that hate is "out there"! That reality has somehow manufactured "hate" and is now "beaming it" at us!
So we live our lives in this backward state of confused thinking. We live thinking that the screen/mirror - "reality" - is the "projector"...and that the projector - us - is the screen/mirror! Yikes!!!
Yet the truth is - there in no "hate" residing in the "out there" reality. It can't - because hate is mental concept - a judgement call, and as such, it can only reside in one's mind. Reality just "is". Emotion can no more reside in reality's "mirror" than a "new hat" can reside in the "everyday" mirror. Any emotion that we sense when viewing reality is merely a reflection of what we have projected.
Awakening/Enlightenment is learning how to face reality and not "project" - learning to take our ""self" out of the picture. Because it is that "you" that obscures the view and prevents us from seeing what lies beyond.
So how do we learn to not "project"? What is it that we "project" with?
We project with our thoughts and opinions - with our pre- conditioned notions, and to see reality we must first learn to turn "projector system" off! It would also help to understand the "cause and effect" - to realize the true nature/source of the "projection" and "screen"!
Subject: Re: world hunger
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Mon, 01 Apr 2002 20:28:15 GMT
Greetings Tom, you wrote: -<clip> ->Money is a weird subject, for how do you control and channel something that ->only exists in the minds of people?
We say the same thing. So it is not a matter of a new criteria for the balance of wealth, but rather the annihilation of the conditioned perception of wealth. Indeed the annihilation of toxic conditionings would bring about much relief to many world ailments, world hunger only being one of them. Empty the mind of the conditioned contents, and we start right at Home. Thank you for your offering.
Subject: Re: Reality and the Grand Trickster
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Mon, 01 Apr 2002 20:45:47 GMT
Greetings Oren, you wrote: ->We project with our thoughts and opinions - with our pre- ->conditioned notions, and to see reality we must first ->learn to turn "projector system" off! It would also ->help to understand the "cause and effect" - to realize ->the true nature/source of the "projection" and "screen"!
Most profound Dear Friend. We say the same thing. So it is not a matter of a new criteria for the balance of wealth, but rather the annihilation of the conditioned perception of wealth. Indeed the annihilation of toxic conditionings would bring about much relief to many world ailments. Empty the mind of the conditioned contents, and we start right at Home. Thank you for your offering.
Subject: losing self
From: "Ragland, Thomas" <TRagland@UMCOM.ORG>
Date: Tue, 2 Apr 2002 07:24:19 -0600
In the West, we have been taught Immersed in Fed That we can become physically immortal That we can make our souls last That we can reach heaven intact
The East is frightening Confusing Buddha speaks of dropping identity With the body With the senses With the mind With what we call self And extinguish all of that The Saivite Hindus speak of Merging with Siva Losing one's distinctness And this is frightening to a Westerner
Buddha spent a lot of time and words Trying to teach us how to Save US from ourselves How to free us from identifying with All that which we are not To save US from the suffering Due to clinging to delusions To awaken US from the control Of that which we once called self
If US did not exist Buddha's dhamma would be pointless If there is no one to save, No one to awaken, No one to stop suffering, Then the dhamma is in vain. For Buddha so loved US That he gave US the dhamma To save US from that which we called self
If US did not exist Then what is it that is going to merge with Siva The real question is Not that which we called self But rather that which is truly US
Subject: Re: losing self
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Tue, 02 Apr 2002 18:04:41 GMT
Greetings Tom, you wrote: ->If US did not exist ->Buddha's dhamma would be pointless ->If there is no one to save, ->No one to awaken, ->No one to stop suffering, ->Then the dhamma is in vain. ->For Buddha so loved US ->That he gave US the dhamma ->To save US from that which we called self -> ->If US did not exist ->Then what is it that is ->going to merge with Siva ->The real question is ->Not that which we called self ->But rather that which is truly US
This is the age old misinterpretation by the West for purposes of Rationalization. Westerners must Justify an "US" and a "Self" so they project their own conditioned notions of such into/onto ancient writings. Regardless of what words they used, Sages of yore in the East spoke of one's True Nature and not the added Baggage we harbor mentally as "US" or "Self". Even when they referred to "clinging" or "holding fast to" the True Nature they were referring to BEing that True Nature and not the projected conditioned notions of Westerners' attachments. To correctly interpret and Truly Understand their Wisdom we must Empty the mind of our conditioned ideas and images and meanings we harbor as the contents of mind. That is why the West continues in it's folly after many years of Eastern influence, they skipped the first step which is Empty the mind of conditioned drivel. If we do not do that first, our seeming self-acknowledged so called understanding is but a Grand Illusion.
If we think that the texts of yore and the offerings by Sages of yore are indeed Truthful and Wise Pointers, then we have to interpret them with Eyes of yore not with our own deluded eye. That is, we can not ever expect to Truly Understand the Wise texts and Wise words of Wise Sages by interpreting them with our modern dictionary of "common usage". They may use the very same words that we use today but they did not always mean *then* what those words mean *today*. Those in the West and even many of those of the East interpret offerings of yore via modern understanding, and it only leads to misunderstanding at best. Mostly it leads to distortion and corruption and misrepresentation. If we Truly want to Understand past offerings of Wisdom we have to BE the very state of BEing those who made the offerings were. Until we can do that, those Wise words are but Veils to our Truly Understanding them. That is, we can not look at them through our eyes but rather through their's. See what they Saw, BE what they Were. We only Fool ourself thinking that we could ever Truly Understand actual Wise offerings by way of our own conditioned thinking.
The question from the East of "Who Am I ?" begs self-inquiry as to who we *think* (are conditioned to *think*) we are to uncover the Fact that such self arising thoughts are generated by our own conditionings and nothing more. Blindness feeding Blindness, a self perpetuating Delusion. Actually we must figure out "Who Am I Not ?", such that what is left is a Pure state of BEing the True Nature we ARE. Which IS Nothing -- No-Thing.
Lose the Self, lose the self, to BE -- simply BE Whatever-IS.
Subject: Re: losing self
From: "Ram Varma" <ramvarma1@rogers.com>
Date: Sun, 31 Mar 2002 11:19:52 -0500
Hi Thomas,
Before one decides to lose or be self, don't you think it is better to define self/Siva. In my understanding Self/Siva is clear from these statements:
" I am the Resurrection and the Life"....Jesus Christ/Bible
" I live in all the beings......" ....Sri Krishna/Sri Bhagvad Gita
"I" as I understand is the Indwelling spirit/Self, same as Siva.
THE INDWELLING SPIRIT/SELF
That vital power which makes a difference of life and death is surely worth understanding and adoring while we are living. It is absurd to wait and see what happens when it departs from the body at the time of death. The real time is now and the real prudence lies in exploring its utilization now to fulfill all the living aspects of our day-to-day life. The fact that we are alive and it is present in us, why don't we make use of such a limitless astounding power?
What is Indwelling Spirit?
It is an essential part of a human being. It is a creating energy. It creates life. It is the higher nature of a person. It is intangible; you cannot see or hold it. It is an internal connection to the all- powerful. It is an unseen sustaining energy. It is that which makes a person feel refreshed/ energized when it is focused on. It is a non-physical connector that connects a person to every thing and every one. It is that which really makes a person feel good, enjoy and exhilarate whatever he/she is doing in the moment. It makes a person a complete human being. Without this connection, something that is real is missing in a person. It is a detached observer in a person, who enables him/her to see the truth, as it is. It is that which directs or gives guidance in the inner silence. It is wholeness; open - realistic - unlimited. Without this, a person is not whole.
Where does the indwelling spirit/self reside?
To better understand indwelling spirit, let's take this word apart. In/Dwell. Of course IN means IN or INSIDE and DWELL means to live. So we have INDWELL which means to live inside. Another word that one knows is the word DWELLING, which means, a place to live. Our physical body is actually a place; where the soul resides. Our physical body is the chosen ambassador for the soul's works. Therefore, the spirit within us is known as the indwelling spirit.It is there to lead, guide and direct our lives. It never makes us do anything that we don't want to do. It only helps us to do what is right. This indwelling spirit doesn't just reside in humans; it is in the air that we breathe, water that we drink, earth, warmth of the sun, mountains, animals, and nature. It exists in each and every life form and is always alive. It is within me in the sixth center (middle of forehead) and I experience it as white light through meditation. The lover and the beloved experience its presence in the oneness of their true love experience. Similarly, it is in the oneness of the experience by the experiencer and the experienced. It is also the source of the transcendental knowledge when the information starts to flow effortlessly in a meditative mode.
How can I see it or feel it?
It can be felt in the actions of kindness, peace, selflessness/ heart-felt charity and humor. A person can also feel its enrichment within, when he/she performs actions for the collective good of the society.One can also feel its presence when action is performed to connect with the other people. It can also be felt through meditation, present moment presence (PMP) and oneness of unconditional love.This love relationship could be between parents and child, lover-beloved and between the seeker and the sought.
The Observer and the Observed (self-observation) can also experience its presence through oneness of observation. The major elements of such a powerful oneness being; 100% absorption, 100% openness and 100% receptivity. This simply means we can experience it in anything we are handling/ responding/ inter-acting with; as long as we are meeting the fore- mentioned criteria of the oneness.
What happens with us after contact is made with the Indwelling Spirit?
When our answers are received, we will be at peace with our-selves.We will also experience self-sufficiency and self- confidence in doing things. It does not matter what we are doing. Spontaneous solutions to problems will take a load off our mind. We will have full clarity of mind thus allowing us to see through people and situations as they are presented. It will spontaneously lead us further to awareness and compassion. From a practical standpoint, we will learn to respect this dwelling place (which is our body). How we take care of it is an important factor in our ambassadorship. Such a powerful contact will help us to anchor ourselves. It will also accelerate our growth and transformation. An experience of "Void" will take us right into lasting peace. Through the practice of self-observation (100% honesty), we will shed the extra baggage that we have been carrying around unnecessarily. An experience of white light or infinite energy will give us balance and we will know the reality of situations. This will further motivate us to render selfless service according to our unique strengths/talents. All these experiences will consistently provide us with a deep sense of exhilaration.
THE SUPREME SPIRIT/ UNIVERSAL ENERGY/SIVA
The kingdom of heaven or the Infinity is accessible at all times, at all places and to all the people across the universe. Although every one would be tempted to have it but only rare ones make genuine moves to be in touch with it. With TOPAHE (trusting, open, positive, accepting, hearty actions and enjoying) attitude and consistent self- effort, it is possible to be there and become the Infinite One in our true nature.
SYNOPSIS OF THE SUPREME SPIRIT/SIVA
It is all-present where it sustains the whole universe being present everywhere and present at all times. It is all-powerful, the highest, the most potent power of the universe. It is the same as the indwelling power in an individual that is ultimately responsible for orchestrating the mechanics of the whole universe. It is infinity with infinite resources, infinite information/knowledge, infinite energy, and infinite love. It is all-pure which is absolutely divine/stainless in nature, greatest purifier/healer in the universe with an all-pure unconditional love to give. It is all-accessible which is accessible to every one at all times. It is accessible through the individual Indwelling Spirit. It enjoys being accessed freely and naturally. It requires no rituals and no intermediate person/thing for establishing the direct connection.
IMPACT OF SUPREME ENERGY/SIVA ON DAY TO DAY LIFE
In conjunction with the Supreme Energy, we can co-create all the aspirations in a struggle-free manner. Whatever we need to know, it will flow into us and we will know it, and whatever resources we need, will be made available to you. Deep inner aspiration backed up with open attitude and self-effort opens up unlimited possibilities in our day-to-day activities. All we need is a strong connection. The more we are connected with your own Self, the more we are connected to the Supreme Self. For the ongoing connection, we need to cultivate an ongoing practice of directing our attention to it.
I would urge all of us to dwell on our real source: the indwelling spirit/Inner God as a part and parcel of the Supreme Spirit/Universal God/Siva.
If Self/Siva is not within the jursidiction of Budhism as you say, Then I would say a combination of Budhism and spirituality could do wonders for a person who is aspiring for unfoldment/self-knowledge.
Subject: Re: losing self
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Tue, 02 Apr 2002 20:25:44 GMT
Excerpts from: "NO WAY" by Ram Tzu
Just who do you think you are? Are you other than God? Are you separate from Me?
If so... What are you made of? Where did it come from?
Don't look to science to help you. The physicists have all become mystics. They're of no more use to you than is Ram Tzu.
If you're really clever you'll turn around And walk away Fast! Hang around here and you're liable to lose Everything you hold dear.
Go back to your church, your temple, Your therapist, your drug dealer, your ashram. There you may find a moments peace. You found it there once. Here is only emptiness for you. You'll find no food for your ego here.
What if your precious sense of self Were to shrivel up and die? Where would you be then? What would happen?
Best not to risk it.
Your New Age Is neither new Nor will it last an age.
You ride a pendulum On a clock wound To run for eternity.
Your despair has Today turned to hope. Tomorrow it will Turn back again.
The walls of oppression You tear down here Will be rebuilt There.
The meek shall Inherit the earth Then the clever ones Will take it back from them.
The torture chamber Will empty And refill.
A disease will Be conquered And a new one will Appear to take its place.
This strikes you As a bleak vision But Ram Tzu knows this...
It is your hope for a better future That keeps you in chains today.
Subject: to empty the self
From: "Ragland, Thomas" <TRagland@UMCOM.ORG>
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2002 06:57:25 -0600
I think it must be easy in Rishikesh In a town of renuncients To empty the self Of all that you are not
I think it must be impossible In America
You are judged by your weight By what colour your skin is By how fashionable you look By how well you can play sports By how fast you learn in school By how well you speak English By how well you drive a car By the size of your office at work By the size of your paycheck By the size of your house By the age of your body
And if you can manage To get past all of the Superficial physical and mental Baggage you have to continue to carry You are trapped by thoughts Embedded in your being Of what you should be ambitious for Of what you should freely enjoy Of what you should secretly enjoy Of what you should shun Of what words you use to label Of your place in the world
Surrounded by inputs of senses Chemical signals wired into your being By the fact that you are incarnate Spatially aware by sight and sound Contacting touches and scents and tastes Experiencing your life Filtered though the mesh Of cultural and traditional thoughts And the mythos paradigm shoved upon you By your parents and schools
Even religion in the West Is demeaning and confusing This God of Love That wants you to eternally suffer Who killed his kid But it is not atonement if you don't believe In the debt of original sin Of some distant ancestors For eating fruit in a garden. You get one life And if you reach eternity at all It is physical resurrection into immortality And if you continue at all It is your very personality --all of the baggage that those in the East tell you to empty yourself of --that continues to exist. As if there was a place where you could meet All people who have died And have them be in tact Exactly as they were >From one lifetime
And even if you are apostate from that Since you grew up in the West It haunts you And for those in the East To tell you to do exactly the opposite It returns to making as much sense As Aristotle analyzing Buddha.
I think it must be easy in Rishikesh In a town of renuncients To empty the self Of all that you are not
I think it must be impossible In America
Subject: RE: Observing a "reality"...
From: "Ragland, Thomas" <TRagland@UMCOM.ORG>
Date: Wed, 3 Apr 2002 10:35:47 -0600
It is exactly in a crisis situation that we stop thinking and do what is required. There have been cases in which people rescued other people in doing something that is physically impossible just because they didn't stop to rationalize it. Like picking up a car to save a child, or running faster than you can go, breaking the rules in the Zen moment of now. When you see the child and the bus, you do not stop to think--you just do your duty in the moment and the universe pushes you into your role in the situation. If you stop and think and plan, it will be too late. I think this is some of what Mr. Light has been trying to get across. The answer is in the Now of Being, and not in the later of planning.
Subject: Re: to empty the self
From: o.dodge@att.net
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 17:44:58 +0000
Hi Tom,
I don't think I could agree more with your "I think it must be impossible in America" poem - or at least the point I THINK you are driving at. I suspect it's probably the core predictament of the majority of people who frequent this message board.
I think most of us find ourselves with this physical need to "survive" coupled to a desire to "become enlightened" in a society that really doesn't seem to "give a rat's ass" about either! Result? - if we focus too long on one concern - the wheels start to fall off the other!
It's rather hard to dedicate one's life to the "emptying of self" while a boss is pressuring you about sales quotas, or a wife is nagging you about how much she needs new furniture! And it's equally as hard to focus on your social/vocational "success" in a dog-eat-dog world while remaining unattached/unconcerned with other people's opinions!
"Pardon me Siddartha...but the bank's on phone and they're wondering why you're late with your mortgage payment?!"
While I'm not sure about the "impossible" part - it sure as hell ain't no damn picnic! Perhaps it requires 100% dedication - which could involve a change of job, divorce, moving, etc...a complete restructuring of our lives. Of course - we then risk having turned our world completely upside-down and stiill not achieving that "thing" that eludes us.
"What price glory!"
Just thinking out loud.
Subject: Re: Observing a "reality"...
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 18:41:57 GMT
Greetings Tom, you wrote: ->It is exactly in a crisis situation that we stop thinking and do what is ->required. There have been cases in which people rescued other people in ->doing something that is physically impossible just because they didn't stop ->to rationalize it. Like picking up a car to save a child, or running faster ->than you can go, breaking the rules in the Zen moment of now. When you see ->the child and the bus, you do not stop to think--you just do your duty in ->the moment and the universe pushes you into your role in the situation. If ->you stop and think and plan, it will be too late. I think this is some of ->what Mr. Light has been trying to get across. The answer is in the Now of ->Being, and not in the later of planning.
Au Contraire Dear Friend, THAT is the "Zen moment of now", AS Whatever-IS. ZaZen, grossly misunderstood by the West, is not just for the meditation sessions, but rather must be emanated thus animated in every aspect of our life. When the mind stops churning out the self-arising conditioned thoughts there is only the Present Moment thus we do what must be done, sometimes beyond conditioned expectations/limitations. But the universe does not push you along in such times but rather you ARE Infinite True Nature at full Potential thus not limited by conditioned notions about physical activity/ability. The conditioned notion that something other than YOU helps or aides or pushes is rooted in the Savior/Salvation Game.
Though there are no "Mr."s here, you are correct that what was Pointed to was the Fact that when we get rid of the conditioned clutter (contents) we harbor mentally so that we are not encumbered by mental limitations/expectations/considerations we no longer stand in our own Way. Thus our Potential is Realized/Recognized as quite limitless, seemingly *beyond* what we *thought*. Most Awesome, most Wondrous, most Clear, most Blissful. Is it not worth a little Work and a little Pain ? If not, well, *Good Luck !* If so, well, *Just Do It !* Yes ?
Subject: Re: to empty the self
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 15:07:45 GMT
Greetings Tom, you wrote: ->I think it must be easy in Rishikesh ->In a town of renuncients ->To empty the self ->Of all that you are not
*Easier* Dear Friend, but it is never "easy" to empty the conditioned contents of mind we are conditioned to harbor whether it be in the East or the West. It could even be a Rationalization of the onlooking West to seemingly Justify it's Fear to "Just Do It !" Another of the West's *avoidance responses*. Yes it is *easier* to do anything when surrounded by others doing the same thing and isolated from outside influences. This is why most Teachers require it, so as to start the student in as Pure a situation as possible because it is so arduous and so Painful to Empty the mind of conditioned contents. Do not Fool yourself, however, by *thinking* it might be "easy" under any conditions.
->I think it must be impossible ->In America
Another Rationalization because you do not want to take up the arduous Painful task ? What is "easy' is to Talk about it, no matter where one is. It is arduous and Painful to let go of those dearly beloved conditioned ideas and images and meanings and notions of all sorts, no matter where one is. But only "impossible" in the conditioned mind, no matter where one is. With all the Glitz and Glitter of the West as a major distraction and deterrent of the Great Work it is indeed a daunting undertaking to Empty oneself of oneself, thus a most worthy *Challenge*. Indeed not an undertaking for the faint of Heart. And must be more important to one than even air. And due to all the Glitz and Glitter and the depths of the roots of conditionings, most of the West have to *Hit the Bottom of the Barrel* or the *End of the Rope* or the Pit of what some call the "Dark Night of the Soul". At that point of realizing that all roads lead nowhere and there is no good reason for anything, that all is pointless, THEN if one is Open and Honest with themselves they can Let Go and BE. BE what ? No, simply BE..... Whatever-IS..... each and every anew Present Moment..... where there is no "self"..... there is only BEing. The Present IS Reality, and a most Wondrous Realization of Ease and Awareness/Understanding. It is Folly to settle for anything Less.
But if you *think* it "impossible", then it is "impossible" for you. But not "impossible" for one who will Openly and Honestly "Just Do It !"
Subject: Observing a "reality"...
From: o.dodge@att.net
Date: Wed, 03 Apr 2002 16:24:10 +0000
Suppose we are observing reality and we see...
A bus traveling down the road, and a 100 yards in front of the bus, we see a small child standing in the road.
What - IF ANYTHING - should we do?!
Should we simply continue to observe, and not project our thoughts and feelings and opinions and conditioning into the situation/reality? Or should we "react" - should we attempt to save the child? What questions might go thru our heads in those few seconds that follow?...
Will the bus swerve and miss the child?!
Will the child get out of the path of the bus on his own?!
If we jump out to save the child - and remove him from what we've determined is the apparent path of the bus - might the bus STILL swerve and then possibly hit us BOTH?!
And if we elect to do nothing - simply continue to observe - and the bus indeed does hit the child - will the rest of the world now consider us cowardly for lack of "action"?! And possibly even worse - if we fail to take action - might we then consider OURSELF cowardly from that day forward?
Any thoughts?! Is there a "right" thing to do?! If we attempt to save the child - it's concievable that we MIGHT possibly do more harm than good, and actually push the child into the path of the swerving bus! Is the "right" thing to do dependent on the outcome?
I suppose the greater point to all of this, is to answer why we seem to insist on eternally projecting our thoughts/opinions into reality...and that answer always seems to include "survival of self". The mind seems hell bent on protecting the "self" from ALL harm - both real and imaginary. And that harm MAY even include pre- concieved notions of how others see us. It seems that no matter how benign/innocent "reality" is - our mind - will still INSIST upon examing it.
For lack of a better word - that's an "importance" of Awakening - to have a core realization that there is NOTHING - no "self" - that actually needs protecting - that there is NOTHING that needs to survive - and that what we consider "self" is merely an illusion. From that context - survival is no longer an issue and the prime motivator.
Now back to that bus/child "reality" for a second...
Suppose you observed that child/bus "reality" and your mind asked NO questions? That "survival of self" was no longer an issue? From that context all your actions - or inaction - would hold the potential to be pure/ethical in its nature - regardless of outcome.
Is the ANSWER to ask NO QUESTIONS?! - to be the "cause" of your action and not the "effect" of your pre- concieved notions? Any thoughts?
Subject: Re: to empty the self
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 03:18:26 GMT
Greetings Oren, you wrote: ->I don't think I could agree more with your "I think it ->must be impossible in America" poem - or at least the ->point I THINK you are driving at. I suspect it's ->probably the core predictament of the majority of people ->who frequent this message board.
Yes, "predicament", but the question might be whether they Realize that they are bumping into walls. Another question might be whether it is self-generated for some selfish ends or whether it is Blind adherence. Predominant to be sure.
->I think most of us find ourselves with this physical ->need to "survive" coupled to a desire to "become ->enlightened" in a society that really doesn't seem ->to "give a rat's ass" about either! Result? - if we ->focus too long on one concern - the wheels start to fall ->off the other!
Ah, the Balancing Game. And the Wheel that Squeaks the loudest is the only one that gets Greased. Survival of the form seeming to be the most pressing we Focus our Attention there, and try to juggle whatever else. We think that we can not Let Go because what good is it to be Enlightened if we do not survive. So we maintain the Great Lie. Problem is that this backward approach continues the wars and conflict and hatred and greed and corruption and all sorts of Suffering. The approach of starting with *survival* and trying to work out the details of the rest is most backward in that the form has a tendency to survive autonomously, thus we can start with Working on Enlightenment and tend to the form as needed. But then, if you are talking about the Cadillac instead of the Pinto, that sort of conditioned so called *survival* is part of the contents we have to let go of. So, starting at the other end of our Condition we Realize/Recognize we are chomping on the Whole Enchilada all at once. Odd thing about Enlightenment and even survival though, does not seem to be much indication that it matters much whether anyone cares or not {8->
->It's rather hard to dedicate one's life to the "emptying ->of self" while a boss is pressuring you about sales ->quotas, or a wife is nagging you about how much she ->needs new furniture! And it's equally as hard to focus ->on your social/vocational "success" in a dog-eat-dog ->world while remaining unattached/unconcerned with other ->people's opinions!
Dear Friend, annihilating the conditioned self game is not the end of the world, but rather the Beginning of Life. True, the self concept is an approach that does seem to work in the greater world, but a slow approach. Inefficient and most wasteful. You see, with the self concept we are totally mind-bound, conditioned programmed controlled manipulated by the contents therein. Which puts us at extreme best, behind ourself. I think it has been mentioned here that just seeing something and responding to it, it takes the mind at lease a half a second to get the information from the retina to the action. Much much longer when there is thinking involved, so we are already behind ourself. We have been talking here of the instantaneous Observation/Response due to "No Mind" (actually no self-arising thoughts generated by mental contents). Why cling to the mind Game which keeps us at least a step behind ourself when we can BE Whatever-IS occurring NOW, placing us and whatever we do right NOW ? No time lost because we are right there where we ARE and doing whatever needs doing at the very instant Present Moment it needs doing. A far more Timeless approach, thus more efficient. Why use an old worn out Tool (the contents harbored in the mind) when an ever anew Present Moment Tool is available ?
->"Pardon me Siddartha...but the bank's on phone and ->they're wondering why you're late with your mortgage ->payment?!"
Yes, a major misconception of the West, that either you can have survival OR Enlightenment but not both. WRONG ! Why settle for half when you can have the Whole Enchilada ? When we use the Correct approach, that is.
->While I'm not sure about the "impossible" part - it sure ->as hell ain't no damn picnic!
Oh more that possible, rather most needed if we expect to *survive*. But you are correct about the Fact that it is not a walk in the park. Though once Undertaken, all the Work and all the Pain is but minor when we think back on what the Suffering was. But of course before to take that First Step, the Fear of such an undertaking prevents us from taking that Chance. But as the old cliche goes, *nothing to Fear but Fear itself* because once we get over the Fear we Realize/Recognize that it is child's play {8->
-> Perhaps it requires 100% ->dedication
*Deep Bow*
-> which could involve a change of job,
No, a change from a mind Full of conditioned contents to a mind that IS Empty.
->divorce,
Not unless you want to go celibate or play the field. Which is not necessary for Awakening.
->moving,
Not unless you do not like where you are. Which, again, is not necessary for Awakening.
->etc...a complete restructuring of our ->lives.
No, just a restructuring of perception to Apperception by Emptying out the perception. THEN our life Unfolds AS Life.
-> Of course - we then risk having turned our world ->completely upside-down
*Deep Bow* Our conditioned projected world.
->and stiill not achieving ->that "thing" that eludes us.
Well..... stop looking for some fool "thing" and perhaps Awakening will no longer elude you.
->"What price glory!"
The Price of Glory is Sleep. The Price of Awakening is Everything you *think*.
->Just thinking out loud.
Thank you for this Dear Friend.
Subject: Re: Observing a "reality"...
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 06:16:14 GMT
Greetings Oren, you wrote: ->Suppose we are observing reality and we see...
First trip hazard: "suppose".
->A bus traveling down the road, and a 100 yards in front ->of the bus, we see a small child standing in the road. -> ->What - IF ANYTHING - should we do?!
Not *think* "What - IF ANYTHING - should we do?!"
->Should we simply continue to observe, and not project ->our thoughts and feelings and opinions and conditioning ->into the situation/reality? Or should we "react" - ->should we attempt to save the child? What questions ->might go thru our heads in those few seconds that ->follow?...
Second trip hazard: "should we or should we not". If indeed Reality is the Observation there are no "shoulds". Mind-bound, we are not Observing at all let alone Reality. Rather what we are observing is the projected content in mind. Sleeping we have such choices, Observing Reality there is only What-IS and only what needs done.
->Will the bus swerve and miss the child?!
Crystal Ball may be Cloudy.
->Will the child get out of the path of the bus on his ->own?!
Perhaps, but the question and questioning is irrelevant. Observing Reality, there are no "ifs" either. Sleeping we have such choices, Observing Reality there is only What-IS and only what needs done.
->If we jump out to save the child - and remove him from ->what we've determined is the apparent path of the bus - ->might the bus STILL swerve and then possibly hit us ->BOTH?!
Trip hazard number 3: "we've determined". Observing Reality, there is nothing to "determine". Sleeping we have such choices, Observing Reality there is only What-IS and only what needs done.
->And if we elect to do nothing -
Trip hazard number 4: "we elect". There are no "choices" in Reality thus none to Observe. Sleeping we have such choices, Observing Reality there is only What-IS and only what needs done.
->simply continue to ->observe - and the bus indeed does hit the child - will ->the rest of the world now consider us cowardly for lack ->of "action"?!
Trip hazard 5: "consider". Observing Reality there is only What-IS and only what needs done, thus opinions of a Sleeping world are most irrelevant. Whatever needed done got done, and whatever did not need doing did not get done. And there is Really no one to do or not do whatever needed done or not done. Sleeping, you never know. Awakening, Whatever-IS will BE.
-> And possibly even worse - if we fail to ->take action - might we then consider OURSELF cowardly ->from that day forward?
And perhaps shoot ourself in the foot for being such SleepWalkers. Sleeping, you never know. Awakening, Whatever-IS will BE.
->Any thoughts?!
None self-arising.
-> Is there a "right" thing to do?!
Whatever needs doing is the right thing to do.
-> If we ->attempt to save the child - it's concievable that we ->MIGHT possibly do more harm than good, and actually push ->the child into the path of the swerving bus! Is ->the "right" thing to do dependent on the outcome?
That depends on the outcome. If whatever needs doing is done then it is the right thing to do. On the other hand, if whatever needs doing is not done then it is not the right thing to do (not doing).
->I suppose the greater point to all of this, is to answer ->why we seem to insist on eternally projecting our ->thoughts/opinions into reality...and that answer always ->seems to include "survival of self".
Sad, but True. Observing our projected conditioned notions *thinking* it is Reality, everything that gets done or does not get done is of selfish motivation. A Sad commentary on the state of humanity.
-> The mind seems ->hell bent on protecting the "self" from ALL harm - both ->real and imaginary. And that harm MAY even include pre- ->concieved notions of how others see us. It seems that ->no matter how benign/innocent "reality" is - our mind - ->will still INSIST upon examing it.
Do not blame the Frog for the Jump, it is just a Frog BEing a Frog Jumping. So too, do not blame the mind for it's contents. The mind is just the mind doing what the mind does, process the contents therein. Emptying the mind, there are no contents to process. It is the contents that protects the "self" for it is protecting itself. Empty of contents, there is no self to protect but rather simply the True Observation AS True Reality. The mind is a Wondrous Tool, but only a Tool. Do we blame the gun when we shoot ourself in the foot ? Do we blame the hammer for our foot hurting when we use the hammer to hit our foot ? Or should we "Drop The Stick" we keep beating ourself with ?
->For lack of a better word - that's an "importance" of ->Awakening - to have a core realization that there is ->NOTHING - no "self" - that actually needs protecting - ->that there is NOTHING that needs to survive - and that ->what we consider "self" is merely an illusion. From ->that context - survival is no longer an issue and the ->prime motivator.
Well, Awakening, Nothing is what we do "have". But, Awakening, there is not "nothing" but actually Everything that Truly IS Reality.
->Now back to that bus/child "reality" for a second... -> ->Suppose you observed that child/bus "reality" and your ->mind asked NO questions? That "survival of self" was no ->longer an issue? From that context all your actions - ->or inaction - would hold the potential to be ->pure/ethical in its nature - regardless of outcome.
Other than the first trip hazard, "suppose", *Deep Bow*.
->Is the ANSWER to ask NO QUESTIONS?!
Observing Reality there is neither "question" nor "answer", there simply IS What-IS.
-> - to be the "cause" ->of your action and not the "effect" of your pre- ->concieved notions?
Trip hazard 6: "your action". Observing Reality the Observer IS the Observed, thus no *Doer* of that which is done or not done. Possession is nine points of Sleep, and has nothing to do with Reality let alone the Observation of such.
-> Any thoughts?
None self-arising.
Subject: RE: to empty the self
From: "Ragland, Thomas" <TRagland@UMCOM.ORG>
Date: Thu, 4 Apr 2002 06:48:28 -0600
I suppose I should stop and mention that I have been subscribed to the Light Mission's Newsletter/Lessons for several years now. Only recently did I subscribe to this email list. It is valued beyond expression to be able to receive personalized responses and feedback. I am coming from a background of Fundamentalist Christianity with a thick Western skull. I have been drawn to Eastern meditations (Hindu, Buddhist, Taoist) because they work. I am now more self confident that the answers within are more important than the pointers without. And paradoxically I now feel I understand much of what Jesus was saying because of adopting a more Eastern perspective.
I just had the thought in response to the excerpt from your post below. The biggest obstacle in the way of enlightenment is to crave enlightenment. If you approach it as some distant future goal to attain and grasp and cling to, or the reviving of some distant past realization experience, then you block your vision of the present moment. If you stop wanting to be enlightened, you have to opportunity of experiencing the moment firsthand, beyond logical words or doctrines or concepts. As long as you crave enlightenment, this craving is as much of a barrier as craving anything else.
Subject: Re: to empty the self
From: ejLight@light-mission.org (E.J.)
Date: Thu, 04 Apr 2002 15:02:48 GMT
Greetings Tom, you wrote: -> I am now more self confident that the answers within are more important than ->the pointers without.
Indeed one must BE "a lamp unto thyself". As no one Saves us but ourself, no one can and no one may, others can Point to the Path, but we ourself must Walk the Way. Yet as long as we cling to the conditioned contents we keep in the Attic, the supposed lamp that seems to light our way is but an Illusion. And the light we see at the end of the tunnel is actually a train barring down on us. We delude ourself thinking that our conditioned notions are the foundation of our seeming understanding and awareness. This is because it is too much work and too painful to bother with Emptying the mind. But until we do Empty all that conditioned contents we guard so dearly, we are still conditioned programmed controlled manipulated automatons playing the Enlightenment Game.
-> And paradoxically I now feel I understand much of ->what Jesus was saying because of adopting a more Eastern perspective.
Yes, Jesus has nothing to do with Christianity as they have nothing in common except his name. And if there was a Jesus pounding the pavement today he would have nothing to do with Christianity and no doubt would be in jail because he would be barging into the churches throwing out the moneychangers.
->I just had the thought in response to the excerpt from your post below. The ->biggest obstacle in the way of enlightenment is to crave enlightenment. If ->you approach it as some distant future goal to attain and grasp and cling ->to, or the reviving of some distant past realization experience, then you ->block your vision of the present moment. If you stop wanting to be ->enlightened, you have to opportunity of experiencing the moment firsthand, ->beyond logical words or doctrines or concepts. As long as you crave ->enlightenment, this craving is as much of a barrier as craving anything ->else.
This is True, any Desire/Craving for anything even Enlightenment is the very wall preventing that Enlightenment. Yet as you stated in an earlier post, the Dedication to Enlightenment must be 100% -- not even 99% or 99.5% or 99.9999999999999999999999999999999999% but rather TOTAL commitment to Enlightenment. Anything less would only be *close*, and *close* does not count when it comes to Enlightenment. And Remember, Enlightenment is a Verb (always Unfolding, as in ever anew).
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